LDS Podcast "Latter-Day Lights" - Inspirational LDS Stories

Choosing Joy Amidst War & Tragedy: Michele Green's Incredible 90-Year Journey - Latter-Day Lights

• Scott Brandley and Alisha Coakley

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When Michele Green was a little girl living in Vietnam, her town was brutally attacked by escaped convicts from a nearby prison, and most of her family were killed, including her parents.

Now an orphan, Michele's life looked bleak.  But God had a plan for her that eventually led her to the gospel, and ultimately to the United States.

With her new found faith, Michele got married and raised an amazing family; however, more trials and tragedy waited in the wings, including various bouts with cancer - one of which led to the loss of a son, a tragic car accident that took the life of another, and a debilitating stroke that left her husband incapacitated for 21 years - forcing her to become his primary caregiver while working full-time and raising their 9 children.

And yet, somehow through it all, she was able to find joy in her journey!

As you listen to Michele's story, you can't help but be drawn in by her humor and wit, and your heart will be touched as you experience the power of true forgiveness, and the ability to find happiness even in times of overwhelming trials.

You will also meet Michele's daughter Cammie Harward, who adds additional commentary, insight, and support for her dear mother.

*** Please SHARE Michele's story and help us spread hope and light to others. ***

To WATCH this episode on YouTube, visit: https://youtu.be/UZgPdcJNQ0g

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Also, if you have a faith-promoting or inspiring story, or know someone who does, please let us know by going to https://www.latterdaylights.com and reaching out to us.

Alisha Coakley:

Hey everyone. I'm Scott Brantley and I'm Alisha Coakley. Every member of the church has a story to share, one that can instill faith, invite growth and inspire others.

Scott Brandley:

On today's episode, we're going to hear about how one remarkable woman, despite witnessing a fatal attack and a life of tragedy, has been shown by the Lord that happiness is always a choice. Welcome to Latter-day Lights. Hey everyone, welcome back to another episode of Latter-day Lights. We're so glad that you're here with us today and we have an incredible story to share with you. And we actually have two guests. We have Cammie Harward and Michelle Green, and Cammie is Michelle's daughter and she's going to be helping her share her story today. So welcome to the show, guys.

Cammie Harward:

Thanks for having us. I'm glad that my mom gets to share her story. It's a remarkable story, her life is remarkable, so I'm glad that she, mom, gets to share her story. It's a remarkable story, her life is remarkable, so I'm glad that she gets to share it with you.

Alisha Coakley:

It really is.

Alisha Coakley:

As soon as I read your email, when you emailed me, cammie, and then we talked on the phone a little bit about it, I was just like, oh my gosh, I think I told all my kids, I told my husband, I didn't tell Scott he doesn't know any like very much at all about it, but, um, just really that's the only word that you can use to describe it Just remarkable, the things that you've gone through and, um, and the, the lessons that you've learned and the light that you're sharing, um, it.

Alisha Coakley:

It really truly is an honor to have you on, michelle, michelle, so we're super excited and very much looking forward to not just it's not even just one story. It's like a life of stories, right, but they all build on each other and have really really helped with your testimony and your outlook and everything like that. So we're excited to get into that. But before we do, why don't we just take a second and just kind of tell us a little bit about you? We'll start with Michelle, if that's okay. You want to kind of tell us a little bit about you, and then, kami, you can tell us too.

Michele Green:

Well, my name is Michelle Jugon-Green Jougon Green and I am living with Cami right now, which is wonderful, because I need help and I'm already. I can't believe, I'm 90 years old and still living. I was hoping my husband would call me and text me, but it's not ready. I'm French. Okay, and that's about all.

Scott Brandley:

I think there's more to that story, probably a little more.

Alisha Coakley:

Kami. What about you?

Cammie Harward:

So I'll give a little bit more introduction about her. So she's lived with me. We live in Logan, logan, utah. She's lived with me for about two years and we're glad that she's with us and I'm glad, but uh, the my, my mom's story has always been one that I found strength in for my, in my own life, and, and it's a story that I think everybody should hear. Yeah, so um. So my mom she was born in in Saigon Vietnam.

Michele Green:

I could have said that Last time.

Cammie Harward:

So she was born in Saigon, Vietnam, and people get really confused at that because they look at her and they don't see that she looks Asian. Yeah, so they're kind of confused and so just a really quick funny story about that is we were.

Cammie Harward:

I was yeah at the Orem City Cemetery on Memorial Day and my mom loves going to the soldiers' graves, the crosses that they put up, and they had the American Legion soldiers and I went with her and they were talking to her and they said we hear an accent. And she says I, you know where are you from. And she says, well, I was born in Vietnam. And before she could say, but actually I'm French, they stopped and they're like you were born in Vietnam. And she says yes, and they're like you've Americanized very well. She's like thank you.

Cammie Harward:

And then they just kept asking her questions. They never gave her a chance to tell her. Tell them that she was French and you were born in Vietnam. She's like yes, and then they looked at me and they're like you were born in Vietnam. I'm like I wasn't born in Vietnam, I'm American. So, um, finally she just let it go and things. And then my youngest son comes walking over who? My youngest son is Asian. And they look and they're like who is, who is this? And he's like that's, this is my grandson. And I said this is my son. And the confusion on their face you were born in Vietnam. They're like did it skip a generation? Like yeah, it's very funny. So she gets she. People get very confused when they say she was born in Vietnam.

Alisha Coakley:

But yeah, and, and she's French, but she's born in Vietnam. So how? How does that work?

Cammie Harward:

so her father go ahead, mom no, you do.

Michele Green:

You do a better job there was.

Cammie Harward:

There was a french colony that lived there and my grandfather, um, worked for the french government.

Cammie Harward:

The yeah, the french government there okay, okay gotcha, and so her village that she lived in was mostly french. Uh, there was there French. There was like a mixed Vietnamese, half Vietnamese, french and French. Yeah, so my biggest blessing, or one of my biggest blessings, is I am named after her parents. So Camille is my grandfather's name and Suzanne is my middle name and that's my grandmother's name, and that's been such a blessing to be able to carry their names and I've had some wonderful experiences, uh, you know with that, some some very spiritual experiences and things. Um, but my mom just celebrated her 90th birthday, so that was very fun. We got to a big party with about 250 people coming and celebrating. She lived in, so she is the oldest surviving member of her family. She's the third oldest of a family of eight children. She has two older siblings.

Michele Green:

Two sisters and one brother.

Cammie Harward:

Three sisters?

Michele Green:

I do yeah, we don't have actually three sisters.

Cammie Harward:

One that you didn't meet. You haven't met yet.

Michele Green:

She's dead now, aw.

Cammie Harward:

So she, oh. So she lived in Vietnam until she was 14. And three years later they moved to France. Her family and, when she was 17, her family. They were introduced to missionaries from the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints and she was baptized three months later and moved to Salt Lake City so that she could be closer to the church and she lived with one of the families of one of the missionaries who taught their family. She lived with them, they became her host family and the first night that she came to the States she met my dad and didn't like him. Did not like him. Yeah, they didn't like each other, but somehow they fixed that and got married years later in the salt lake temple and they had nine children. I'm six of nine and um, how old are 12?

Alisha Coakley:

you wanted 12 you wanted a whole dozen. Yeah, why not? Why not Wow?

Cammie Harward:

That's phenomenal. Yeah, I don't know. I have five and I don't know how she did mine.

Alisha Coakley:

I have three, and that's enough for me.

Michele Green:

Wow, my husband was single. He was an only child, an only child, and he wanted 36 children.

Scott Brandley:

Oh well then nine is a good compromise.

Alisha Coakley:

That's where polygamy comes into play. That's right. You'd have to get three wives with 12 kids each. So there you go, my mama served two missions as a single senior sister missionary.

Cammie Harward:

She served in Fiji.

Michele Green:

I don't know why they sent me to Fiji, because I said I wanted to go to France or Vietnam or Nauvoo. They sent me to Fiji.

Alisha Coakley:

Well, it's Fiji. It's better than maybe being sent to like North Dakota Right.

Scott Brandley:

That would have been a letdown.

Michele Green:

Nothing against North Dakota. It's a wonderful mission. Wow, it's good.

Cammie Harward:

We all wanted to go and pick her up on her mission. And she says, no, save your money, because the Fiji you think I'm at I'm not. She says you have to go to a resort for that Fiji is not a resort. Gotcha, it was good. It was good. She was 72 when she served a mission in Fiji. Wow, that was old. Mission in Fiji. Wow, that was old.

Cammie Harward:

And then, when she came home, she served as a service missionary for about four years Now. Let's see. Yeah, like I said, she has nine children. She has 32 grandchildren, uh, 19 great-grandchildren and one on the way that will be born in August and one great-great-grandchild. Oh my gosh, she's had lots of different callings from primary teacher. Primary is my best colleague, it's true, everybody else here is Grandma Green.

Alisha Coakley:

Oh, that is wow so cool.

Cammie Harward:

She's lived a life that most people can't comprehend or believe.

Alisha Coakley:

I'm crazy, that's it and you're so funny, serious, we haven't even started this show, hardly at all, then you're cracking up I know every day must be an adventure, or throw around right canny yeah so wow, there you go.

Cammie Harward:

That's my mom in a nutshell oh, I love it.

Alisha Coakley:

That is awesome, all right, well, we're. I. I'm super excited to hear all of the story, and I know Scott's really excited to hear it too, and so are our listeners. So we're going to turn the time over to you. So, michelle, do you want to kind of take us back to like the very beginning, like what was your, you know, earliest childhood memories, like Well, I was born in Vietnam, in Saigon.

Michele Green:

It was a wonderful life. I had. How many brothers and sisters. I had three sisters, there were seven children and my mother was expecting an eighth one. And I was told very often that my parents had a marriage made in heaven. And I truly believe that, because my father just worshipped in some way my mother and he treated her like a queen and it was interesting that we never celebrated our birthday, but we always celebrated my mother's birthday. Really, we didn't care about our birthday, we just knew that we celebrated my mother's birthday. Wow, she was the queen and Papa just loved her, and I believe that.

Michele Green:

Well my father and mother had a farm and we had pigs, we had horses, we had rabbits, we had chicken, I mean all kinds. So we lived on and we had goats and we lived off the farm and so my father taught us how to kill a chicken and uh I couldn't do that. I couldn't, uh, slice the throat of the chicken and right, so I couldn't do it.

Michele Green:

So I had my brother do it for me until he retired and he said it's your responsibility to do what dad wants you to do. So I took the chicken and I you usually had to put him kind of to sleep, but then you cut his throat and that's what you do. So I took the chicken and knocked him with a two by four. The chicken was kind of knocked out. I took the chicken and I showed my mother that I had killed the chicken and she said yeah, but you have to clean it. So I said I can't do that. I says well, then you have to put, since you killed the chicken, you put it in the fridge and tell your dad. And you know the consequences, the consequences if you didn't do what my dad, the responsibilities that your dad gave you. You were sent to bed without any supper.

Cammie Harward:

So when my dad came, well, so she forgot that after she had knocked it after she had killed the chicken, beat it with the two-by-four. They had to pluck it.

Michele Green:

Yeah. So I put him in hot water and I plucked the chicken, wrapped him and put him in the fridge. And then my father came and asked me if I had done my work and my mother came to my rescue and said well, she killed a chicken, but you have to help her to clean it. So I was afraid to get the consequences, which was not bad. You were sent to bed without supper. My brother always brought me a sandwich, so it was fine. But my brother always brought me a sandwich, so it was fun. My father went to open the fridge where the chicken was and the chicken jumped out. Oh no, he had just been knocked out. So my father looked at the chicken and he looked at me and he said this chicken deserved to live, so you take care of it, because he was completely naked.

Alisha Coakley:

He'd been knocked out, boiled and plucked and refrigerated.

Michele Green:

So he became my pet and I kept and refrigerated. He became my pet.

Scott Brandley:

And I kept him in bed.

Michele Green:

Did you name him? I called him Caroline, that was my pet. Anyway, that's my pet, wow.

Cammie Harward:

She said that it never grew feathers back, except for on its elbows.

Michele Green:

Oh my gosh, how long did it live for I don't know, because the Japanese came and took our house and everything, so the chicken stayed with the Japanese. I hope they treated him well because I did after what I did to him. He did very well.

Scott Brandley:

Tried to make up for it. Yes.

Michele Green:

Like I say, I called him Caroline.

Scott Brandley:

Oh.

Michele Green:

That's my chicken story.

Alisha Coakley:

Oh my gosh.

Michele Green:

That's so funny. Yes, and it was a wonderful life in Saigon with my parents and my brothers and sisters. We had a wonderful life until we were under the occupation of the Japanese, 1940?, 1939. 1939, when Saigon was taken by the Japanese. And it was a fun, fun life because you had to be very, very careful what you did. Sometimes, if you put your V, that meant victory and you would be sometimes stopped and put into concentration camp.

Michele Green:

Wow, my father ended up in concentration camp for about three months because he tried to save a lady from being trampled by a Japanese soldier with his horse. Oh, my gosh, he ended up in a concentration camp and when he came home my mother ran to him and he said to her. I remember that he said to my mother don't touch me. And because he had been beaten, that his whole body was black and blue. Wow, my mother took my father in the bedroom and took care of him. It was not a fun time during the Japanese occupation, but we survived that. And when the Japanese lost the war, we were so elated so we hardly could wait for them to leave. But we didn't know that yet the worst was yet to come, because the Japanese opened the door of the prison and everything, and our community, which was a city where we lived, was attacked.

Cammie Harward:

And I heard after that there was at least more than 400 people killed that day, wow at least more than 400 people killed that day, and her village went from a village of about 800 down to about 300 in just a matter of hours.

Alisha Coakley:

This was in September of 1945.

Michele Green:

Okay, how old were you, michelle? I was 11. 11 years old, okay. And so they came to our home and knocked the doors. There was hundreds of them out and they were trying to go break our door, and my grandfather and my father put furniture against the doors, but they kept pushing it, pushing it. So finally my grandfather and father told them if we open the door, the men will go with you, but unless you leave the women and the children. And they agreed, and they my father opened the door and in case, they came in and took all the men and took the woman.

Michele Green:

There was a woman group and a man group and for some reason my sister Nicole, my older sister, and myself were put with a man group, I don't know why. And so we were pushed into some little boats and they took us and we walked through the jungle until we ended up in an area where they started to massacre everybody. My sister Nicole was the first one, and then my grandfather was killed and many men were killed and I thought, well, my turn is going to come, and pretty soon they took all the men and I never saw them again. There was a few men, some of them were killed with machete. So I was able to see that. So I guess that's what they're going to do to me, but they didn't. I was the only one who survived from that group, oh my gosh. And before my father was taken away, he said michelle, never, never forget to pray. My father was a very, very religious man and he said to me Michelle, never forget to pray. And I was not ready to pray at that time because I could see so many people being killed. And they took my parents, my uncle and many men away and we never found their body, and so I was all by myself from that group.

Michele Green:

So I was all by myself from that group. And then they took me along some villages who kept beating me while I was walking through the villages until we got to another villages where I saw my mother and my mother's group was there. So I ran to her and she asked me where my father was, my uncle and my sister, and I told them they were dead. She said well, she prepared us that it's going to happen to us also. She said but we'll see Papa again.

Michele Green:

So we just waited in the little room, neighbors, and all my brothers and sisters, and then soon they came and took all the women and I never saw my mother again, but find out how she was killed, which was horrible. And they put us in a kind of pagoda Can you say that? Is that a pagoda? Yeah. And they put all the kids in there except for the boys. They took all the boys out and then we heard gunfire and we all put ourselves on the floor and then the door opened and a giant of a man with a kind of red hair looked at us and said are you the Jugand children? And we said yes. He said come with us. So we went with him and then they put us into some army truck and then we went to. They drove us to Saigon where my uncles were waiting for us. So after that I lived with my uncle and my aunt, her children which was not a very pretty time because my uncle was not very nice.

Michele Green:

But one thing about my uncle he used to beat all his children and one day we were all in the elevator. He owned a hotel and we loved to play in the elevators. And so we were all in the elevators and my grandfather stopped the elevator and he slapped everybody but me. And I realized that my uncle never, never hit me, but he hit everybody but me and I tried so hard to put my face in front of me so he would slap me too, but he never did, but he slapped everybody.

Michele Green:

So it was not a fun time to leave my uncle, but I lived with him till I was 17 and then that's when I joined the church, the company the missionary came to our home and taught us this gospel, which I did not want to hear. So every time the missionary would come I would sneak into the bedroom so I would not listen to them. I was a Catholic and I would die a Catholic. So every time thearies were there I would end up in my bedroom. Until one day I came home from work and I tried to be very quiet to go to my bedroom, but apparently my aunt heard me and said Michelle, please come in the living room and listen to the missionaries in the living room and listen to the missionaries. And reluctantly I went and I tried to interrupt the missionaries so often but the missionaries were very nice, they just ignored me and just kept talking and giving out the message until I heard a voice that said listen and I completely ignored it. And then the missionary kept going and, missionary, once time again the voice came and said listen. And I just did not listen. And the third time the voice came very strong listen. And I thought everybody had heard it. Everybody was listening to the missionaries and the missionary. So I decided to listen and the missionary were talking about the plan of salvation, to listen. And the missionary was talking about the plan of salvation, which gave me the answer that I'd been praying for so long that I would see my parents again.

Michele Green:

Because after my parents died, I went to the priest that lived around the corner of our home. There was a church there and I asked him. I asked the priest, I said where is my parents? And the priest told me they never received their last rite because they are in purgatory. And purgatory to me was this to me. It was a terrible place. It was not a happy place and my parents died so hard they couldn't be in purgatory, they couldn't, and so I left him really, really upset.

Michele Green:

And then when the missionary when I heard those voices telling me to listen, the missionary were telling me the plan of salvation that I would be able to see my parents, I would be able to see my brothers, I would be able to see my sister, that was the answer to my prayer, because I always remember my father telling me to always pray. And I kept praying, not like I pray now, but just a prayer that I memorized in the Catholic, and I guess Heavenly Father hears and listens to all the people. And I received the answer that I needed, that I would be able to see my parents. And so I can hardly wait for my husband to call me. Maybe he's busy doing what he's doing right now. He loves to do research on Jews, so he was watching some Jews up there and ignoring me. Anyway, Wow.

Michele Green:

I hope someday when it's my. I'm 90 right now, so I hope I don't last much longer so that I can go and see. I'm looking forward to see my parents, my brothers and sisters. My husband would be last. I love him. I mean that doesn't mean that I don't love him. I'm sorry, I love him. I mean that doesn't mean that I don't love him. Okay, I'm sorry, but I will say my brother was my best friend. We were always doing things together. So I'm really looking forward to seeing him and seeing my brothers and sisters my brother and my mother and father, my little sister who was born after my mother was killed.

Cammie Harward:

It was from a special revelation that was given to my mom's aunt, who took them in, that she was sick one day and in and out of consciousness and in and out of sleeping. And my grandmother visited her and had a conversation with her and my aunt we called her Mammy and she said I noticed that you're not pregnant anymore. And she says, no, I had my baby. And she says, oh, what did you have? And she said I had a beautiful little girl. So it was by special revelation that they know that she has a sister that she's never met. And my aunt, in that same, in that same dream, I asked her you know, um, did you suffer? And she said just for a moment, I suffered, just for a moment. She said, but I'm so happy now.

Michele Green:

The gospel has really helped me. When I asked to be baptized, I was 17, and I had to have my uncle's permission Every time I asked him for something he always said no, I don't know why.

Michele Green:

I wanted to be a stewardess and he said no. I wanted to be a nurse, and he said no. There was a place where we lived where people took care of children and they wanted somebody you know, hire somebody. So I asked my uncle if I could go and work there. He said no. So everything. I asked my brother, my uncle he said no. I was so mad at him. But then I came and asked him I want to be baptized and I was waiting for a no, and he said what took you so long? Wow, I looked at him and said what he said. What took you so long? So I was baptized and joined the church.

Scott Brandley:

So I was baptized and joined the church. So was your uncle and aunt's family baptized too, or?

Michele Green:

just you. Well, my cousin was baptized, I was baptized, my sister was baptized, although she left the church, she's a born Christian. My brother brother was baptized and he's active. My other sister also is active. So all of us, the children that lived, all of them are active, except for my younger sister. She's a born again Christian, wow. So she's okay. She's a good person, very religious, so and everything went fine.

Michele Green:

And then, when I moved to after I was baptized, I asked my uncle if I could go to America and he, he said yes, which surprised me. And so to the place where you work paper, you know, you have to have your passport and all that and they refused it because I was born in Vietnam. And so, my uncle, I came back home and I told my uncle that they didn't want to let me go to America. And he said why? He said because I was born in Vietnam. So he took me and we went back to that place, went back to that place and he had a paper that told that the government, the French government, had written what the children went through, that they were orphaned, and blah, blah, blah, blah. And so he showed that to them and I was quickly accepted to go to America. Wow, it was in that paper.

Alisha Coakley:

Did you go by yourself or did any of your siblings go?

Michele Green:

with you by myself. Yeah, Wow, yeah, I was 17. But when I got to America I missed my family so much. I wanted to go back to France.

Cammie Harward:

Yeah.

Michele Green:

My uncle. I wrote to my uncle. He says I want to come back. Papi, can you bring me back? And he says certainly not. You are stuck there and you will live there. So I did, and that was the best thing I ever did, and now I'm an American.

Alisha Coakley:

Well so take us, you get to America. You mentioned that you met your husband the first day and you didn't like him. How did that all go?

Michele Green:

Well, he was all the mission, the French missionary and all the members would get together once in a while and we had games and or you know some skit and things like that, and and my husband was always a master of ceremony I thought he was a show-off and when he met so you know when when he finished whatever he was doing, he was very funny. He was very funny and my dream of the man that I wanted to marry was going to be very tall, very wavy, dark hair, like my dad, smoke pipe that's what's a long time ago and have a leg shorter than the other one, because my uncle had the leg that was shorter than the other one, and the way he walked I just loved it. So I wanted my husband to have the same walk.

Scott Brandley:

Some swagger.

Alisha Coakley:

Yeah.

Michele Green:

My husband was very short, was, I think, an inch and a half taller than I, was Completely bald, a professor, didn't smoke a pipe, didn't have a limp, he was going to ask my girlfriend for a date and we were called to sing a quartet. And we went into the room to practice and he said the alto didn't show up. So he asked me to come and sing the alto and I said I don't sing. I says well, let's practice and see. So I practice. And when we finish practice, I told him I says john, I cannot sing. I says, well, just try, and if you don't sing, if you get off you don't off key I'll squeeze your hand. I says okay. So as soon as we started singing, he scores my hand. I sang bass with him. So he asked me to go out for a date. Wow, so that's history. Now we got married about three years after, okay, and we had nine children.

Michele Green:

The second one wasn't my second one was it Okay. I had Scott, jeffrey, evan, alan, carrie, who was my, my daughter, cammie, nicole, three girls. I had four boys, three girls, and then two boys, brent and Richard, and Jeffrey was. I was about seven months pregnant with her when I started to go into labor and so I.

Michele Green:

It was a Sunday and my husband was at church and my husband was at church, so they called my husband and my husband brought a friend, paul Gardner, and Paul gave me a blessing and he said that in the blessing he said that the child would live, because the doctor, when I called the doctor, he started to tell me, since he was so early in the pregnancy, that the child might not make it. But in the blessing it says that he would live. So when I went to the hospital, the doctor prepared me for a dead child and I kept telling them, no, it's going to be okay. And the doctor just couldn't, you know, say no, we just wanted to prepare that you will have, he's so early. Well, jeffrey was born. He was two pounds.

Cammie Harward:

This was in 1958.

Alisha Coakley:

1958., oh wow so real dangerous then, yeah, three and a half months early and he lived. Oh, wow, so real dangerous then, yeah, yeah.

Cammie Harward:

Three and a half months early and he lived.

Michele Green:

He was wonderful. I had to cut the diaper in half in order to put him in. They were still too big. Wow, wow, he lived till he was 18. And he was on the way to work when I heard when, uh, where he was work at roy rogers restaurant in those days, there was a roy roy rogers and, uh, the roy rogers called me and say where's jeffrey? He's not here yet. I says where he left. He should be there anytime. And then, right after I hung the phone, my husband say you need to come and sit down. I says why? He says because there was two police officer in the room and they were coming to tell me that Jeffrey had been killed, that a young boy of 14 had taken his dad's car and was driving and speeding. The police was after him to stop him, but he didn't stop at the stop sign and ran into Jeff sign and ran into Jeff. So that was hard because Jeffrey lived so many he almost died of.

Cammie Harward:

Drowning, huh, drowning. He almost drowned when he was two, oh yeah.

Michele Green:

He was most drowned when he was two. He almost burned. When he was five, he almost burned. When he was five, he almost died of.

Cammie Harward:

Ate glass.

Michele Green:

Yeah, he ate his Holy cow. His brother was feeding him. Grass, glass, crazy kids.

Cammie Harward:

He got measles when he was.

Michele Green:

He got measles when he was. He got measles that he was very, very bad Anyway. So he survived a lot of things and then he ended up being killed by a car. I could not understand that. I could not understand that.

Cammie Harward:

Like I said so, there was many times throughout Jeff's life that he should not have lived through when he was 17,. They thought that he had leukemia Leukemia.

Michele Green:

And then almost he was playing football on Sunday and they called me and said that Jeffrey was hurt very bad, that he had broken his neck and they were taking him to the hospital and Jeffrey. So I went and Jeffrey kept saying mom, I'm sorry I played on Sunday, I'm sorry I play on Sunday, but he didn't have a broken neck and he survived that he killed by a car accident. It was ridiculous. So after he died, before the funeral, my husband had all of us kneel down and pray, and so all the children knelt down and had to say a prayer, what they were thankful for and about Jeff. And when I was the last one, my husband was the first one and all the eight kids were in between.

Michele Green:

And when I was waiting to pray, I said what am I going to pray about? I said I lost a son, he was killed, so what can I pray about? And I just struggled and struggled until a small voice said you had him for 18 years, I need him now. And so I was fine. So I was able to pray that I knew where Jeffrey was, I knew he was happy and that Heavenly Father needed him more than I needed him. So it was a good experience for me, sad but good. So Jeffrey was fine. He's busy preparing people, because I had a dream about him and he said Mom, I'm preparing people, so I know he's doing well. There's so many, so many wonderful spiritual experiences that I that I experienced. It's, it's amazing. So I'm so grateful for the gospel.

Scott Brandley:

It's my life.

Cammie Harward:

Anyway, and then Four years after about four years after, almost almost to day was when Dad had his stroke.

Michele Green:

Oh yeah, Well, that's not true. I don't want to talk about that. My husband had his stroke for 21 years. He is a man that could speak seven languages but just ended up only speaking English, Very stuttering and everything, but he was able to learn to speak English.

Cammie Harward:

He was only 54 when he had his stroke, which is the age that I am right now. Oh, really.

Michele Green:

He kept saying I had the stroke for you. What does that mean he had the stroke for you. What does that mean he had a stroke for me. What a block.

Cammie Harward:

Wow.

Michele Green:

You know, but he lived 21 years and then he died of cancer. And talking about cancer, my son Evan, when he was how old was he when he had the cancer? He was about 30, that he had a cancer and got operation after operation for so many cancers and on Valentine's Day he passed away. So I lost the boys that are waiting for me on the other side. Wow, life is not. What do I say? I know terrible things happen to everybody, it's not just me. Things happen. But you have to have a I'm thinking in French right now Positive, positive, yeah, positive outlook and positive attitude to live a good life. Attitude to live a good life. And because you know that when I die, I'll see my two sons, I'll see my husband, I'll see my parents, I'll see my brother and sister. What a joy, what a happy thoughts that is.

Cammie Harward:

You know, the neat thing is that my mom was able to, soon after she joined the church she was arguing with speaking with some friends. She was in France, her and her siblings and her friends had found out that they had been baptized and were getting angry at them. Like you went against what you were taught. Your parents would never have joined the church and you would never have been baptized. They never would have left the catholic church. And just before she started to argue, uh, just a small voice told her to not argue that they had accepted the gospel.

Michele Green:

Wow.

Alisha Coakley:

Awesome.

Michele Green:

Small voices don't argue, they have accepted it. So, I was fine and I didn't argue with them.

Cammie Harward:

And then they were able. When all of her siblings came to the States, they were able to do all the temple work for her family.

Michele Green:

Yeah.

Cammie Harward:

And seal all of them together and seal their sister that they've never met, baby girl Jugon the native.

Michele Green:

That was done, for her work to be sealed to my parents. That's wonderful about the gospel. That's always so positive. You know, yeah, with what you go, you rely on the gospel and you just see some, something positive. That's what the gospel always done with me. I mean, with the challenges that I've had and I'm sure we'll have. I hope not. I hope I. I'm 90, so maybe tomorrow I'll go up there or down there, I don't know. You know there's something positive to think about. If you don't, you'll be miserable all your life.

Michele Green:

If I'm negative about the things that I experienced. I saw my older sister really kill so badly. I mean, if I told you the way she was killed, I mean I still see it, but if I dwell on it I would be sick, I would be, sick.

Scott Brandley:

It's amazing that you can still be positive. It is, you have to be.

Michele Green:

That's what the gospel is giving you. You know there's other things better to look for. You know I'm looking forward to go and see my loved one, and that's a positive attitude. You know I'm. I'm looking forward to go and see my loved one, and that's a positive attitude. You know, I mean I've talked to. When I lost Jeffrey.

Michele Green:

I had a friend that also like lost a son, and so I went to visit her and talk to her and she could not believe that I was not crying because she was in tears and miserable and I kept telling her but your son is okay, it's okay. No, he should be with me. He should be with me. I says, okay, he should be with me, he should be with me. I says, okay, he's not with me, jeffrey is not with me, but they are in a better place, they are happy and they are needed up there. But she couldn't accept that and she has been miserable to have lost a son and she died just a few days before Jeffrey was killed. So she never got over it and I'm fine. I'm fine. I mean I miss him. I wish I could have seen him live, be married, have children and all that. But he's needed up there, he's busy.

Cammie Harward:

You know father needed him so, and so she's always told us what a difference between her parents, death parents and siblings. To the death of my brothers and her husband, you know my, my dad says it's weird to say sweet, you know, when you talk about death. But she says the pain and agony of not knowing where my parents were, you know, and then to be told that they're in purgatory, that is forever suffering. You know a place. They can never get out of that um it, they're just always in pain, they're always suffering. Um, and then to learn of the plan of salvation, but in comparison of with my brother's, you know death of, she says.

Cammie Harward:

You use the word sweet, she says because I knew right where they were. I knew exactly, I didn't have to go through that hardship of right where they were. I knew exactly, I didn't have to go through that hardship of questioning where they were. And you know death is death is never easy and we've talked about that, you know, these last couple months. You know death is not easy and you know it's not that someone dies, it's like I know where they are, it's great, yeah with everything that I witnessed witness I would be.

Michele Green:

If I keep thinking about it, I mean, it was not pretty, that's for sure, because that day at least 400 people die. And uh, and watching all that, uh, I would. How do you say that in French? Miserable, miserable, miserable, yeah, mm-hmm.

Scott Brandley:

God definitely had a plan, a bigger plan for you, Michelle.

Michele Green:

Definitely, definitely, and I'm glad that the missionary came to our home and finally made me listen to them.

Scott Brandley:

Yeah.

Michele Green:

I mean, I had a cat, his name was Zazu, and every time the missionary would talk, I would throw the cat to them, so you know, to get them to be distracted. You know, yeah, they just threw the cat back at me and kept going on their mission. I kept doing that this game. Please listen, you know so my Heavenly Father had other plans for me. Yeah, I'm so grateful for that.

Alisha Coakley:

So, Michelle, will you tell us a little bit about the sign that's hanging up behind you?

Michele Green:

Oh, what does it say? Happiness is a choice. Where?

Alisha Coakley:

did that come from?

Michele Green:

Well, we don't know. My brother, my son Brent, went to Vietnam and he went to see my house and that house, that sign was hanging at my house. How it got there, we don't know. I feel like my mother put it there and because happiness is a choice, and but why it was there, we don't know. So my son Brent brought it back and gave it to us and give it to us.

Cammie Harward:

Well, he brought that, he took a picture. So he went to Vietnam on a business trip and leading up to the trip he reached out to his host and shared a little bit of my mom's story and asked if he he could, you know, maybe find some of the places that and and kind of take him around. And, um, so the, his, his host, says, let me do some research and see what I can find. And so when they went, he was able to, um, find the school that she attended, find the church that she attended. Inside the church there was a brick.

Michele Green:

Oh yeah, that story.

Michele Green:

So my mom said my mom had my aunt and my mother had two. Each of them had a daughter about the same age, and they both came down with meningitis and so they went to the hospital. But it ended up that they couldn't take care of my sister because my father didn't have enough money to pay the hospital father was not, didn't have enough money to pay the hospital, so they sent my sister home and kept my cousin at the hospital, and so my mother was not a very religious person, but she took care of my sister with a meningitis and pray to, she said, well, the Catholics. She prayed to St Therese, teresa, which this is my middle name to please help my sister take care of my sister, and my mother took care of her and she kept praying and praying to St Therese and my sister lived, but my cousin, who was in the hospital, died and my aunt really resented that, that my sister, who was not in the hospital, had the care that my, that my cousin, received at the hospital, died, but my sister lived.

Michele Green:

So my aunt never forgave that.

Cammie Harward:

That's where that brick came from, that my brother saw. It was a prayer brick and it's still there. So this was 2013 when he went, but in this church that prayer brick is still there this is um.

Michele Green:

This is cynthia's yeah and uh.

Cammie Harward:

So he got to see a bunch of a bunch of things and then he was taken to the street or the area where my mom's house and village would be and then said this, roundabout, knowing you know, uh, doing the research, I found this is where your mom's house should have been and they, of course, it's now covered with uh standing where all of that was is a apartment complex and above the door, which is this sign um was a billboard sign and that said happiness is a choice. And, like I said, our um, all the other billboard signs, all the other signs around there were all in vietnamese and this is

Cammie Harward:

in English and it was located above the opening of this apartment complex. And so my brother, you know, he sent us pictures of everything and then sent us a picture of that, and so I did all this and I sent pictures out to all of my siblings and and things for Christmas present. But he says, if anything that embodies and and um, explains my mom and her parents or her siblings, uh, that survived their lives, it's, it's that statement that happiness is a choice. I mean, you meet each of them and they're just incredible people that just have such a wonderful outlook on life that you know, seeing and going through some, some horrible, horrible tragedies in their life, that they can look on it, look and look forward and say, yeah, I, I'm happy.

Cammie Harward:

And that's one of the biggest lessons my mom has always taught us each of our kids to um, she always has said the statement of bear your burden well and uh, so I went through, I went through cancer five years ago and, uh, that was always on my mind of I need to bear this. I, my mom taught me that bear my burden Well and but when I asked her several years ago, I'm like you know, you, you talking to her, I'm like you could look on your life, look through your life, and say Mike, I was dealt a rough, a rough hand.

Alisha Coakley:

My life was crap.

Cammie Harward:

And I'm like, and you would have every right to be bitter, to be angry and to be resentful. And I said and yet you look on your life with joy and you can be happy about it. And her response is one that I just, I won't ever forget. She says because I have been blessed. I've been blessed more than I have, than any heartache that I've been, that I've gone through. That's true, that because of the Savior and because of my relationship with god, I can find joy and I can continue to find joy in everything, and so that's been such a great lesson to me and uh, and so I mean you can.

Michele Green:

You can have a miserable life, that's for sure. But who wants to be miserable, miserable?

Alisha Coakley:

yeah, I don't. It's not fun. It gives us wrinkles we don't need that I'm happy wow well, I'm thinking about you.

Scott Brandley:

Know you had 18 years with your one son, with Jeff.

Michele Green:

Yes.

Scott Brandley:

And you had all these other kids. Think of all the blessings that have come into your life from your other children that you've had, you know, and just all the cool things, the good things that have happened in your life.

Michele Green:

I'm so blessed that I have eight children now still alive and I told them if anybody dies before I do, I give them all for adoption Anyway. So I mean I just I mean all my kids, all eight of them are just wonderful. They're just good kids. So I can't complain. I've been blessed and all my eight kids now are just wonderful. I couldn't ask for better. They always think of me. They always say what can I do? And Cammie, right there, I got so sick I had to move in with her, and now I don't have to do anything, I just sit there and everything. What do you need, grandma? What do you need Mom? I can't. What else can you want me to do? Yeah, and the only thing I want to do is for my husband to call me, but he's busy teaching the jews, yeah that's what he that's what he did his research on was the french jews, wow, okay wow can I share your story of when you she had had it taking care of my dad?

Cammie Harward:

So my dad when he had his stroke oh yeah, the stroke changes people. It changes their personality. They they're very angry. It was not the same, yeah. And so I was 10 when he had his stroke and he so my dad was very athletic, he knew all of these things, but after his stroke he was very aggressive, he was very mean.

Cammie Harward:

Um, and my mom there was still seven of us at home still seven kids at home, from 16 down to four that all of a sudden, my mom, as a full-time mom, had to go to work full-time, and so my dad needed a lot of caring, for he was in the hospital for nine months after he had his stroke. Months after he had his stroke, and, uh, and the doctors had told him that whatever he was going to learn, whatever he got back after a year, was all he was going to have, and all he could say was one one, and morning was the only words that he could say, and he couldn't talk. And so my mom refused to let someone who knew seven languages fluently. He was a genius, he spoke seven languages fluently and perfectly, as if he was native from those countries, people would hear him speak French. So he served a French mission in Geneva, switzerland, so he knew French Wow.

Michele Green:

His French was better than mine. They asked me, and several people asked me oh, you speak French so well. And I said well, I'm French, oh okay. And then another person asked me the same thing and I said I'm French, oh okay. So three people asked me that. So finally it says I learned French from my husband. Oh, that's why you speak so well. That was an insult.

Cammie Harward:

He did Wow, that was an insult. So after his stroke, my mom refused to, you know, reduce him to two words. So she labeled the whole house and, uh, we were not allowed to pass him anything at the dinner table unless he asked for it. Wow, which was very, very hard because he would just point and one one one, one, one, one one.

Cammie Harward:

But anyway, so you know, growing up with him was hard. I don't have very many memories of him before his stroke. I don't have very many memories of him before his stroke and I remember about six months from the time that he got out of the hospital. For about six months we would go to church and, even though he couldn't speak, we would sing the hymns in sacrament meeting and he could sing perfectly and I was so angry for a long time because I thought he was faking it. I'm like you're, you're putting us through all of this Like you're, you're a liar, and and then that only lasted about six months and then he lost that as well.

Cammie Harward:

But, um, my mom, you know, I had to take care of all of us, including her husband, who for most of his life, needed full-time care for 21 years. And so one day she, she had just had it. She just like I, I can't do this anymore. He was, you know, like I said, he would get aggressive. He would get aggressive sometimes and and, uh, she grabbed her keys and left. It's like I can't do this anymore.

Michele Green:

I was going to leave.

Cammie Harward:

And she drove and drove and drove, and she was gone for hours and she finally, Something told me to return.

Cammie Harward:

Yeah, she. She said she had a heard a voice to that she needed to go back. And so she came and said she parked in the driveway and just was just pleading with heavenly father of please help me. And she just yelled. She's like like, do you even hear my prayers, do you even hear me? And for some reason she turned on the radio and, um, the song playing on the radio was a child's prayer that with the words saying heavenly father, are you really there? Do you hear and answer every child's prayer? And then the second verse came on and, uh, you know that tells pray. He is there, speak, he is listening. Um, you are his child, his love surrounds you, he hears your prayers, he loves your love.

Cammie Harward:

She just all of a sudden got her answer that I know you, I'm here for you, I've never left you.

Michele Green:

So I had to go back.

Cammie Harward:

She had to go back.

Scott Brandley:

You're like dang it yes dang it.

Michele Green:

But I took care of him. He was a wonderful husband, but the stroke has changed him, but it was okay. It was okay and he ended up dying of cancer. So it was not the stroke that killed him, but it was the cancer that killed him. He's in a better place.

Scott Brandley:

Yeah, when you do get to meet him, he's going to be the guy you remember, right.

Cammie Harward:

Exactly yeah, my mom is an avid studier of scriptures and loves the scriptures, and she has always found these verses that resonate with her that read in the Doctrine and Covenants.

Michele Green:

Yeah, I'll say I have it there in the Doctrine and Covenants, in this 122, verse, 79. 77. And it says If thou shalt be cast in the pit or in the hands of murderers and the sentence of death passed upon thee, if thou be cast into the deep, if the billowing surge conspire against thee, if fierce winds become thine enemy, if the heavens gather blackness and the element combine the edge up the way, and, above all, if the very jaws of hell shall gap open the mouth wide after thee, know thou, my son and my daughter, that all these things shall give thee experience and shall be for thy good. The son of man has descended below them all. Art thou greater than he? Therefore, I read that this in the Doctrine and Covenants, I mean it has been such a big help to me. You know, everything is so true. It is so true that God shall be with you forever. And he is. He is always with me and even if I have negative thoughts, I think he's slapping me.

Alisha Coakley:

No more of that Maybe he's got to take a spiritual 2x4 to you, like you did that chicken I get it sometimes.

Michele Green:

Somebody told me how can you do that to a chicken? Could have been better to cut his throat. I hope he's not. Somebody told me that he's going to wait for me when I go into the what you call it, the gate yeah, he'll be there.

Scott Brandley:

Caroline will be there he'll be like that chicken on Moana that just follows her around that poor chicken.

Michele Green:

His name is Caroline, so you know he has a name, so he'll be fine. That poor chicken, his name is Caroline, so you know he has a name, so he'll be fine. So that's about all I have on my thing. I have wonderful children, I had a wonderful husband and I had a wonderful job. I work at UVU and that helped quite a bit because the people I work with were just wonderful. Because I had to go every what two or three hours I had to go home to take care of my husband and come back to work, and sometimes I would sleep at work and my boss would come by and could see me sleeping. So he would say everybody quiet, michelle is asleep.

Michele Green:

So he was very, very nice boss, so I couldn't ask for a better job. And I worked there for 16 years and then I had to quit to take care of them, you know, until my husband died. So I had a good life. I had a good life. I mean, sometime I would have given up, but no, no, I just life goes on. If you want to be miserable, be miserable, but I don't want to be miserable. I'm a weird person.

Alisha Coakley:

You're an inspiration.

Scott Brandley:

That's what you are? Yeah, if that's the case, I want to be weird.

Alisha Coakley:

I know I want to be weird too.

Scott Brandley:

I want to be weird like you.

Alisha Coakley:

I want to be just like Grandma Green.

Michele Green:

That's what my primary children I love to teach primary, and they all call me Grandma Green. Matter of fact, when they released me from primary, they didn't release me as Sister Michelle Green, they released me as Sister Grandma Green. Oh that's cute, I don't know. I'm sure it is, that was funny. Anyway, it was fun. It was fun. I love primary.

Alisha Coakley:

Man, michelle, just wow, I don't think I've ever cried or laughed so much on an episode before.

Alisha Coakley:

You just taken me on this emotional rollercoaster ride and I have loved every single second of it.

Alisha Coakley:

You know, I, just I am so in awe of you and I love, I have to say, I know, with with mother's day you know being being nigh that I'm watching this relationship between you and your daughter and it is just warming my heart so much to see the love that you two have for each other and to know that, despite all of the things that you went through as a child, that you have become this incredible, remarkable mother. You know not only your kiddos, but to you know you think about the people that you served, whether it was in the church, in primary, or if it was on your mission missions plural and I just think you know when you said that heavenly father gave you Jeffrey for 18 years and that he needed him over there, I think the reason why you're here for as long as you've been here is because so many people still need you here and so you just did too good of a job and Heavenly Father is like nah, she's good, we're going to keep her in that calling for a little bit longer.

Michele Green:

I don't know, I just want my husband to call me, but he's busy with the Jews up there.

Alisha Coakley:

But you know what? I think you've been pretty busy here too, so that could be.

Michele Green:

I'm in El Tecumseh right now with my daughter and her daughter.

Cammie Harward:

She was a primary teacher until COVID hit. She was 86 when she got ready to be a primary teacher, which was not fun.

Michele Green:

Covid-19 killed me yeah.

Cammie Harward:

Yeah, I have to agree with.

Scott Brandley:

Alisha, I think you're a beacon of light in the world.

Michele Green:

Michelle, thank you, thank you, thank you. I love my life. I really do. I mean, I've had some terrible things happen, but there's always an answer to it. You know I don't dwell on it, because I know I have happy thoughts about it, because that's what I'm looking forward to it. I will see my parents, I will see my husband, I will see my children. I will see everybody. The only thing is I'm wondering if I would. No, I'm not going to say it.

Cammie Harward:

What a joyous reunion it's going to be.

Michele Green:

Well, I wonder if Grandma Green, my mother-in-law, will accept me, because I was not very nice with her.

Scott Brandley:

I'm sure she will.

Michele Green:

I tried.

Cammie Harward:

It will be a great, great reunion.

Michele Green:

Yeah, it will be a great great reunion yeah yeah, she loved her son and just didn't think he was going to get married, because she moved to Utah to be with him and when she came here he was engaged to me. Wow, so you know.

Alisha Coakley:

I think on the other side they have a lot more information than we do here. I think there's going to be a lot more understanding and compassion and grace on the other side with all the ones that we had a little bit of friction with in life.

Michele Green:

I did a lot well with her, but at the beginning it was very hard. Yeah, she was a faithful woman.

Scott Brandley:

very very faithful. So well this. This has been so much fun, michelle and cammy.

Alisha Coakley:

Thank you guys so much for for being here and sharing your story with us yeah, absolutely, and and I don't know how you guys found our show, but I am so grateful that you did and that you guys reached out. I gotta ask, mich ask Michelle, is this your first podcast? I know you've done like firesides and stuff and talks, but is this your first podcast?

Michele Green:

It is my first podcast. I was so mad at her when she said I had to do that because I did not want to do it.

Cammie Harward:

She doesn't know what podcasts are.

Alisha Coakley:

So you're still experiencing things for the first time at 90 years old right, I don't know.

Michele Green:

Yeah, it's all new to me. You know, at my age I mean even to look on my phone to see something. I just don't know how to work it.

Scott Brandley:

Yeah, the things I mean, it's German to me, well think of Michelle, michelle, think of this like a fireside, but now everyone in the world can watch it.

Alisha Coakley:

I'm glad we're telling her this at the end.

Cammie Harward:

Every fireside that she gives, she always gets nervous because all of these people. And I said you're only talking to two people, that's it, that's true. And she's like, oh, two people, they're not going to want to hear my story.

Scott Brandley:

And I said, but then they share it with the world, so yeah, this is good, because now people can hear your story and you're sharing your light and your happiness is a choice with everyone else. You're going to do a lot of good in the world by sharing your story today.

Cammie Harward:

Thank you, Scott. Yeah, I've loved your, your podcast. So I was when you excused yourself as yourself, Alisha, I was telling him I've listened for about nine months to your guys' podcast and on. And then it was when I heard what. Who did you say, Randall?

Scott Brandley:

Jensen Randall Jensen, yeah.

Cammie Harward:

So I had kind of thought about sending my mom's story to you. And then when I heard him and then he talked about his time in vietnam and things yeah, I sent it. I was like no, I need to. And so that's when I reached out. And then, probably for the past oh, two, three months, I've gone all the way back to your very beginning and just listened by one by one.

Cammie Harward:

So I've heard your, you know your, your family story and you know things like that, and you losing your brother, which I'm sorry about, and and things, and so all great stories. And then the one that we're on, that she actually was listening to today, I was listening this week. It was I, she I can't remember the name, but she had adopted a little girl, had a little boy, and then the daughter had ended up passing away In a car accident.

Alisha Coakley:

Oh yeah, marianne, I believe.

Cammie Harward:

Yeah, for me because and I, you know, wanted my mom to hear it because it wasn't so much of the story that it there was similar things to it, but it was the, the baby before that, the like the mother had, you know, seen her name was Michelle and different things, and so to me it was kind of a tender mercy of okay, I'll see, see, this is, it's going to be okay, and because she's been very nervous and and and things. So, yes, no, and I I appreciate, uh, your guys's podcast and and the comfort is kind of a funny word, but just the comfort and the inspiration that that you know I find. You know, in listening to people you know, finding finding their path and finding reason to continue moving forward, and in hardships and in good things and in bad, of like, okay, see, finding unnecessarily the reason of why things happen, but but being able to to find the lessons in it that you know Heavenly Father is hoping to teach and that we can learn.

Cammie Harward:

So always with you, yeah, so thank you for that.

Alisha Coakley:

Well, you both are officially part of the family now. We love it and we're we're so grateful to have you guys here and to share the story. And I'm still crying. We're done to share the story. I'm still crying. We're done talking about the story and I'm still crying. I just it's just been a beautiful, beautiful story and you know, yes, tragic and so hard, but you're, you both are just beautiful souls and you can just see the light of. Christ shining through both of you, and you know it's just warms my heart.

Michele Green:

That's the best way to be, you know. Have your father as with you forever. And that's what I think every day. Yeah, Because without him I wouldn't be nothing. I would be nothing, I would be what would I be Nothing?

Scott Brandley:

Yeah.

Cammie Harward:

Yeah, thank you. Yeah, go be with your families thank you, scott and alisha thank you

Alisha Coakley:

well. Again, we really appreciate, you know, cammy reaching out to us and michelle being willing to share your story and everything like that, and we just are so thankful that that guests like you have the courage to come out to try some new things or maybe even if you've done a podcast before to to do another one. I think it's it's so needed in this world. We just need as much light as we possibly can get and and we definitely need more shining examples like Michelle, who can just continue to to choose happiness, you know, to just let that be a choice that we make every single day in every single circumstance, and so thank you so much for sharing your light with us and thank you to all of our listeners.

Alisha Coakley:

Um, guys, leave a. Leave a comment. Definitely leave a comment for Cammie and Michelle. Um, you know, just just let them know, like, what your favorite part of the story was and if you learned anything new or if you were inspired. It's it's always so good to hear feedback, so I want to definitely encourage all of our listeners to to drop a comment, leave some feedback for the story today and definitely, definitely, definitely do your five second missionary work. Push that share button and make sure that we get um Michelle's story out there to the rest of the world, because this is just going to be beautiful, yeah.

Scott Brandley:

And if you guys have a story that you want to share, like Michelle, go to latterdaylightscom and let us know, so we can share your light with the world as well. So, once again, thank you guys for being on the show thank you, yeah and we will see you guys next week when we have another episode for you. So till then, take care okay, thank you.

People on this episode

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Scott Brandley

Host
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Alisha Coakley

Co-host